On 2017-10-29 23:59:02 johndoe69za said:
More and more rules as we move closer and closer to the totally offend no one nanny state. sign of the times

It's very fun and awesome to say that when your not the one being offended.
Mxim f**king privilege

So why does ESA allow guys to post a review when they haven't see the lady? Surely these posts should be removed?

Example first post in this thread:
www.esa.co.za/forum/thread.php

The lady Antoinette's prayer to the punting community to only review a lady if you have met her in person is perfectly reasonable.

Nor is her plea to eschew crudities in describing the service provider's person at all unreasonable.

I agree Ben - those parts are not unreasonable. However, the second part is extremely ambiguous. But the problem comes in when a lady has, in fact been no lady at all, but instead been a right raving bitch. Do you have the right to say that or will you now get banned? There is a world of difference between "she was extremely bitchy towards me" and "her demeanour was mildly churlish".

What worries me most is Antoinette's bit about "she will be watching all reviews and comments" and banning people if they post things she doesn't like. The net result of THAT attitude is that every review in essence becomes Antoinette's because it all has to pass through her completely undefined filter.

Anyway that's just my opinion. I won't ever be reviewing again while this system is in place, but as I stated previously that's not a great loss to the ESA community at all, but it is entirely conceivable that I am not alone in this.

On 2017-10-30 08:16:25 oraljim said:


What worries me most is Antoinette's bit about "she will be watching all reviews and comments" and banning people if they post things she doesn't like. The net result of THAT attitude is that every review in essence becomes Antoinette's because it all has to pass through her completely undefined filter.

This I do agree with.
Saying "I couldn't go through with it because her teeth were black" is info that is meaningful to me.
Saying "I think the service could be improved with some denistry" doesn't carry the same weight because I may just think the punter in question is full of it if he has a problem with a molar that's off centre.

There are however many needlessly hurtful comments and reviews around (someone saying a girl's face reminds him of down syndrome is an example I saw recently).

The forums and reviews section seems to be more aggressive as of late. I think it's a sign of the times honestly as we all expect a little more bang for our buck.

On 2017-10-30 06:21:56 zwan said:
I don't get why people are freaking out about this. You are still allowed to post a negative comment/critique on someones profile if you have seen them or not.

Just be a bloody gentleman about it. If someones skin is not to your standard instead of saying jeez her skin is fucked say unfortunately her skin is not up to my standard.

Same goes with giving compliments instead of saying nice tits, rather say lovely breasts or boobs.

Some guys don't realize its people reading the comments made about them.

Like

Dear oraljim,

I am not certain how the guidelines are not clear, DO NOT DISRESPECT THE LADIES BY BASHING THEM, BE A GENTLEMAN AND COMMENT OR REVIEW IN A RESPECTFUL CONSTRUCTIVE MANNER.

Surely the gentleman who use the services on offer would like to get the most value for money and surely the ladies want input which can help them improve their service offerings.
This forum is a community and as such surely those who interact here want to do so for the benefit of their fellow punters and the ladies who advertise here.

Oraljim you seem to have no concept of community, it's about YOU, only. That is very sad indeed. You directly qualify that you have no interest in making reviews or adding any value period.
The entire vain of your post is negative and more than slightly misogynistic, you clearly have no value to add, by your very own admission.

We want parties who are able to conduct themselves as gentleman on this site and if you think that you are not capable of being a gentleman, then feel free to not visit the purple site again.

My request is not unreasonable, you should in all cases treat a woman like a lady, I have not once said that we want only good comments and reviews, what I asked is that when anyone has any kind of comment or review that it be constructive. Constructive (helping to improve; promoting further development or advancement)

Calling a lady, a bitch is not constructive to this site and adds no value.

Every lady/gentleman on this site deserves respect and deserves to be treated with dignity.

I would like to reiterate that I would like the gentlemen who use this site to conduct themselves accordingly and to kindly be respectful and constructive when they comment or review.
The ladies who advertise here offer services of a very personal and intimate nature, you sir, desire those services, it would behoove you to consider being more gracious.

Thank you
Antionette

OralJim is saying what we are all thinking and getting bashed for it. There are lovely, absolutely lovely ladies on this site. And they get their fair shake of reviews, and once in a while a negative one, which immediately gets drowned by a trove of good reviews again. Now should that one negative punter who had a kak experience get a double dealing of getting his ass banned as well? This is some nanny state maneuvers here. There are notorious underperformers on the site, and deservedly get bashed for it. I challenge anyone, anyone to bash Sugar and see how much hateration they call upon themselves. Personally I say let the community deal with imbeciles if they dare use slander and crude language, not one person because as OralJim has pointed out, it becomes an opinion of one person and one person alone and that, is not fair.

On 2017-10-30 22:33:37 ESA Forum Admin said:
I am not certain how the guidelines are not clear, DO NOT DISRESPECT THE LADIES BY BASHING THEM, BE A GENTLEMAN AND COMMENT OR REVIEW IN A RESPECTFUL CONSTRUCTIVE MANNER.

Respect is earned, not demanded.

On 2017-10-30 22:33:37 ESA Forum Admin said:

Surely the gentleman who use the services on offer would like to get the most value for money and surely the ladies want input which can help them improve their service offerings.

Despite being a forum admin you very clearly have never read the reviews forums very much. Almost every single time without fail that a punter says anything negative about his experience, no matter how politely put, the WG usually denies it vehemently, and in many cases runs to you crying about unfair treatment. I don't think you grasp what a "review" is about. When Ebert and Roper review a movie, if they don't like it, do you think the producers of that movie run crying to them? Or run crying to whatever newspaper the reviewers are talking about? No. They let other reviews speak for them and let the audience reading the reviews make a choice about which reviews they want to follow. It is not up to Ebert and Roper to help the director be better. Likewise, it is not up to a punter's review to help make a WG be better. A review is *SUPPOSED* to be about how the reviewer as an individual perceived the service. We are not goddamned career guidance councilors. It is up to the WG herself to read negative feedback and either accept it and use it as a means of improving her service, or reject it because the reviewer was being an asshole.

[QUOTE;896314;ESA Forum Admin]This forum is a community and as such surely those who interact here want to do so for the benefit of their fellow punters and the ladies who advertise here.[/QUOTE]
Sometimes yes sometimes no. A community is usually made up of diverse elements. Some you will like, some you won't. What real adults do in a community, is you listen to those you like and ignore the ones you don't. What you are trying to achieve here is a level of homogeneity that eliminates all individualism, and only contains your sit-around-the-fire-singing-kumbaya crew where everyone lives in a world where everyone gets along. Not only is that naive in the extreme it is also insulting to anyone with a backbone that dares to have an opinion that differs. Is that really what you want? A comfortable little echo chamber where absolutely nobody challenges opinions, we all just sit around and politely agree with each other? Or when we disagree we have to do so in terms that are so polluted with happy feel-good sentiments that any voice of dissent is effectively silenced? That is what it looks and sounds like to me.

[QUOTE;896314;ESA Forum Admin]Oraljim you seem to have no concept of community, it's about YOU, only. That is very sad indeed.[/QUOTE]
Spare your pity for someone that needs it. I am not a sheep. I am a long-standing member of this community - longer than you - and I have always spoken my mind. Some people agree with me, others don't. Either one is fine by me. But I will ALWAYS express my true and honest feelings. I wont blow smoke up the admins ass just to get brownie points and I won't wilt away when someone challenges my opinions. I don't hold an opinion unless I believe it is correct, so I am always prepared to defend my opinions, and I do so until someone gives me a reasoned, rational argument that proves me wrong. That is called being rational. And of COURSE it is about me - when I write my feelings down by very definition its about me, what else do you expect?

[QUOTE;896314;ESA Forum Admin]You directly qualify that you have no interest in making reviews or adding any value period.[/QUOTE]
Now you are being both dishonest and completely disingenuous. For openers, I never said I wouldn't add value - the time I am taking to respond to your post now is valuable time. I never said I won't participate in the forums. What I said was, I won't review while we are under threat of being banned if we don't measure up to your *VERY ILL DEFINED* set of rules. You say *BE CONSTRUCTIVE* - but to me - telling the truth is the single most constructive thing you can do. But you don't want the truth in reviews - you want them to be career self-help advice pieces. While those are the constraints - damned skippy I won't review.

[QUOTE;896314;ESA Forum Admin]The entire vain of your post is negative and more than slightly misogynistic, you clearly have no value to add, by your very own admission.[/QUOTE]
I call you a bald-faced liar right to your face. I am the exact opposite of a misogynist. I have nothing but the highest respect for women in this profession and I challenge you to ask any of the ladies I have spent time with how they see me. I am generous, polite and always a gentleman. I may disagree with people on the forums, some quite vociferously so (like Lolita / Jihah) and think that that individual is a horrible person, but I still respect the work she does. No ma'am - to call me a misogynist is about as far from the truth as it is possible to get. And the only thing I admitted to adding no value to was to reviews, because I tend to visit the same girls and my existing reviews say all that I want to say about the lady in question. If their service changes, THEN I will correct my review. But nice try trying to put words in my mouth. You know damned well you are being disingenuous.

[QUOTE;896314;ESA Forum Admin]if you think that you are not capable of being a gentleman, then feel free to not visit the purple site again.[/QUOTE]
If your definition of "being a gentleman" means that I have to always agree with you (or others) and keep my opinion to myself, or white-wash it in ambiguous terms to support your little echo chamber, then no, I am not capable of being a gentleman under those terms - because that is *NOT HUMAN* - it's called being a puppet.

[QUOTE;896314;ESA Forum Admin]My request is not unreasonable, you should in all cases treat a woman like a lady[/QUOTE]
Ah and therein lies the rub. It was *NOT A REQUEST*. It was an *ORDER UNDER THREAT OF BEING BANNED*. And I also 100% disagree with the "always treat a woman like a lady" part too. Feminists have been trying for CENTURIES to be treated equally. I refuse to undo the last 40 years of social progress because YOU personally think that women are the weaker sex and need any form of special treatment. They DON'T. They deserve the EXACT SAME RESPECT that any human being does. Their vagina does not qualify them for any special treatment, any more than my penis qualifies me for any special treatment. It is people LIKE YOU that hold back the progress of women. You perpetuate the stereotype that women are poor little defenseless violets that needs molly-coddling and special treatment in order to survive. YOU are the misogynist if you believe that. If a woman treats me with dignity and respect she will get the same back in spades. If she treats me with rudeness and disrespect, she will get THAT back, in spades. And the same goes for ANY HUMAN I EVER MEET - regardless of gender, race, social position, sexual orientation, religion, political affiliation. I treat absolutely everybody the same. There are enough people on this site that have met me that can vouch for that, your boss included.

On 2017-10-30 06:37:14 Fboy said:
It's very fun and awesome to say that when your not the one being offended.
Mxim f**king privilege

Do you know what happens after you've been offended? NOTHING. Absolutely NOTHING happens to you. Real adults realise that being offended is part of life and we move on. It's got nothing to do with privilege at all, and everything to do with having a spine and being able to survive in a world where not everyone thinks or speaks the same way you do.