Thank you Arizona, 'tis a good synonym.

Ever been in a supermarket queue in SA?
...and witness the cashiers pour out their hearts to each other in a. l...o...n...g dialogue completely ignoring YOU, the paying customer?

Ever experienced how everything comes to a grinding halt in December in SA?

Ever been to a bank in SA and witness the lackadaisical attitude of the staff?

On 2016-01-19 09:22:11 brucelee said:
Ben layden has every right to call himself "lazy". As 4 the rest of us? Don't call us lazy bruh;

We South Africans are an apathetic bunch.

On 2016-01-19 21:44:39 johnd said:
@deamonza: I definitely have a chip on my shoulder, I doubt it is about white supremacy though. I appreciate your criticism. I am not sure that we can take the cost of utilities in one home from one city, Barcelona, and extrapolate that for the rest of Europe.
My comment is not for the benefit of South Africa, it is a narrow (and selfish) view from the perspective of rich white people. What you say is true that South Africa will suffer but my point is that in any population some will succeed more than others and the ones that will succeed in SA is the rich because they can afford to send their children to private schools and good universities. The collapse of quality in the national education system broadens the gap between the rich and the poor, to the benefit of rich children. There is a serious skills shortage in SA which ensures good jobs go to well educated children, irrespective of race. BEE does not stop educated whites from getting jobs, it just makes job seeking a little more frustrating. Thus goverment corruption in education benefits the rich and their children. The ANC may claim to be popularist but look at the leaders of the ANC and they are all elitist, to our benefit. That is why I do not whine about the ANC, they are doing a better job than the Nats at making whites rich.

You say your chip is not about white supremacy but you constantly point out rich white people as the beneficiaries of all the rot. This is in fact not true though.
Yes, the wealthy in SA are able to leverage any opportunity but where in the world is this different and can you really say with a straight face that the african wealthy haven't done the very same thing ???

Please also keep in mind that there is a bigger picture that it is missed when the ANC talk about white wealth. Statistics... The achievement of a statistical equivalency between the whites, Indian and Africans in SA is, and always will be, completely impossible.
To raise the African middle-class to an equivalent percentage will require the GDP of SA to expand to 3 times it's level. But this is never looked at is it.
The African middle class in numerical figures exceeds the entire white population of SA, is this looked at or discussed ?
There are more African millionaires in SA then the are White middle class and wealthy put together but the drum gets banged about white wealth ???
Please, this is the naive thinking that allows the ANC to lead around the masses by their noses while they help themselves to everything that you have worked for, but hey, its your vote... use it as you feel you need to. But don't blame me when your rights are eroded, the media muzzled, foreign investment chased away and our economy gets plunged in a nightmare spiral.

As to your comment about using Barcelona as an example for the whole of Europe... It is certainly not an absolute fact that the utility prices are equal all over Europe. It is however a more accurate statement then yours claiming that the utilities in SA are cheaper then Europe when they are in fact not all more expensive then SA as my example proves.

On 2016-01-14 18:14:40 Ben Layden said:
There is a culture of mediocrity which is very apparent in all spheres of South African society.

We are a lazy bunch.
We have a thousand and one excuses for having messed up.

And there is no accountability for the high trust placed by the citizenry on extremely well remunerated public officials.

Any criticism of their mediocre performance is silenced by the well worn catch phrase:
So what are YOU doing about it?

Wow applause to this comment.The fact that the majority of South Africans always complain and quick to point out the negative things that our country faces,they never compliment or appreciate positive things.Like mr Bens quote says:what are you doing about it?exactly!!!My opinion is that there is absolutley no way Racism will end.Debating with racism is the same as debating with the Bible & believes,there is no point!!Its a good thing though because we get to hear different opinions and learn some new things we were not aware of!!Fellow South africans: learn to "appreciate" some countries are facing the worst!!!THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!

Deamonza,

Your "There are more African millionaires in SA then the are White middle class and wealthy put together.." is an interesting phrase.
I love reading your posts, but you also know that exactly 53.593% of statistics are sucked out of a thumb. Then also, anyone who owns a modicum of a house is a millionaire these days, or multimillionaire if it has a pool.
What is your source(s), got a link perhaps?

Ben,

what do YOU do about "...and witness the cashiers pour out their hearts to each other in a. l...o...n...g dialogue completely ignoring YOU, the paying customer?" ?
As these convo's are invariably over-the-top loud I start talking to 'my' cashier a notch too loud as well, attracting instant attention from isles away, saying I find myself insulted by her nattering with someone else whilst she is handling my shopping.
If this does not help instantaneously some persistence pays here, or, too loud again, requesting the other to seize their conversation with 'my' cashier, for reason she may make a mistake costing money or time, and if the latter it will also delay those behind me in the queue too.
This has worked thus far, simply speaking up. Think that's racist?

On 2016-01-20 07:08:06 Chmoks said:
Deamonza,

Your "There are more African millionaires in SA then the are White middle class and wealthy put together.." is an interesting phrase.
I love reading your posts, but you also know that exactly 53.593% of statistics are sucked out of a thumb. Then also, anyone who owns a modicum of a house is a millionaire these days, or multimillionaire if it has a pool.
What is your source(s), got a link perhaps?

Statistics SA, various articles in the media, news reports, bloomberg...

@deamonza, lets put this to rest. My orinigal point is that whites in general benefit from corrupt civil servants, so there is no point whinning about it. You seem to disagree and neither of us has hard evidence. Look at the statssa employment statistics and see how whites have less unemployment than any other race. Look at the senior management of SA companies, they are overwhelmingly white. That is not to say that corruption got those white people jobs but that white people are more successful than black people at opperating in our current corrupt system. Hence corruption (via incompetence) benefits the whites, and I do not know why or offer a reason why, that is just the observation.

Electricity is cheaper in SA than in Spain if wikipedia is to be considered a reliable source of information. In fact electricity in SA is about half the price of electricity in the UK. We have little to whine about.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_pricing

We are fairly a new democracy. Of course expectations for this transformation will differ from one person to the other. To hope or expert these things to disappear overnight will be bluntly naive. There is still a huge amount of mistrust between races and that resulting from how we were raised. The most "civilized" and developed nations of the world still battle with it. America for instance has been on the 'democratic path' for the past 300 years or more and still battle with this issue.
My guess is that it will get better with time (can be 50 to 150 years). Without a doubt, our children are relating much better than us and their children once the oumas and the oupas have passed on will relate much better than them. My guess is that South Africa will move faster on the transformation track than the USA. The most important thing is to seriously appreciate each other first as human beings and second as South African. This will go a long way of helping us to appreciate our South Africanness and respect for one another. You can say anything you like about Americans - in their diverse cultures, religions and practices, once an issue arise that threatens their national security or national pride, they leave their difference and join forces to tackle that threat. They are first Americans and anything else second. That is the difference between them and us.
How do we measure progress? Again this will differ from one person to the other motivated by our individual expectations. For example, the South African Institute of Race Relations (SAIRR) in their latest report were concerned that there were very few interracial marriages - not contributing to the rainbow nation at the rate that was expected. What will be your measuring stick?

On 2016-01-20 07:21:45 Chmoks said:
Ben,
If this does not help instantaneously some persistence pays here, or, too loud again, requesting the other to seize their conversation with 'my' cashier, for reason she may make a mistake costing money or time, and if the latter it will also delay those behind me in the queue too.
This has worked thus far, simply speaking up. Think that's racist?

No Chmoks I don't think it's racist.

As long as you politely ask them to cease their conversation and focus on YOU, the paying customer.

My measuring stick is when the words

Black

White

Coloured

Indian

Used in a sentence does not raise eyebrows and have people flying off on a tangent delving into unrelated issues that were not raised in that instant.

There are unsavoury types no matter the skin color as there are awesome people no mater the skin color gender or creed.

Xxx
B.